Lucifer item build

Discussion in 'Game Strategy' started by blckdrgn, Aug 31, 2010.

  1. blckdrgn

    blckdrgn Well-Known Member

    Heres what I have been doing lately

    dagon (if enemies are easily nuked to death)
    guin (if strong tank/carry heros)

    For boots treads dont give very much move speed and he does not have any DPS type skills to benefit much from the attack speed and has high str gain anyway so the HP is not very necessary. Arcane boots can be good to keep you ganking constantly since you wont have mana issues but the lack of move speed or any other benefit makes them a sub par choice. Phase seems to be the best balance to give him good move speed, phasing over units, and some decent damage.

    The old travels/rad build is not very reliable as it is difficult to farm and weak against a lot of line ups.

    Lets hear your opinions.
    Last edited: Aug 31, 2010
  2. smashville

    smashville Well-Known Member

    I tend to like shivas on him since it slows enemies in an aoe and solves armor and mana problems. Guinsoo certainly is always an option on any caster. You might find that euls will be more realistic to farm, gives you a decent ms bonus (very nice when coupled with a speed creep and fire or just fire), and the disable is always nice. Aga is always useful on this hero as well. Linkins can also be a decent choice for stats regen and the all important block.

    I know it sounds a little ambiguous but for a hero like doom it all depends on your allies and enemies for what you need to build.

    I'm not a fan of dagon tbh unless you have a pugna on your team or your enemies are too stupid to buy hp. It doesn't add a hell of a lot of mana for an intel item for it's cost and the burst damage costs too much mana given that lucy has a garbage mana pool.
  3. turtle.slayer

    turtle.slayer Well-Known Member

    why not build him as a carry?
    vanguard radi assault satanic heart travels
    he can afford it . so why not?
  4. blckdrgn

    blckdrgn Well-Known Member

    Because he can't afford that.

    @smashville check my replay, I didnt have mana problems with just soul ring. Shivas/Euls are interesting ideas. I dont like linkens as it is a defensive item and I prefer to play Lucifer aggressively offensive. In my opinion scepter is more of a luxury since its benefits are not really worth the money. For the same price you could have a 600 dmg dagon or guinsoo.
  5. smashville

    smashville Well-Known Member

    Your enemies picked a horrible team - 4 carries/semi carries and cm.

    SR is interesting, it's a double edged sword to me. On one hand you get necessary mana on the other hand you lose hp for just temporary mana. If you want to make use of all of your skills including a creep's skill that you devour you're looking at about 4 skills per team fight and there's no way SR can cover for all of them. I'd rather just get a mana item with an extra disable/skill than use an item slot on a SR on any hero who can't turn that mana back to hp.
  6. blckdrgn

    blckdrgn Well-Known Member

    Thats what scorched earth is for... If you are ganking so much that soul ring is not enough mana you could get arcane boots instead of phase, then there are no mana problems. Usually though after I get soul ring it is plenty for mana until I get a staff of wizardry/void stone then I dont really have mana issues, even after dagon.
  7. smashville

    smashville Well-Known Member

    Scorched earth doesn't give that much hp. It's used for ms rather than hp. And it has a rather long cd if you plan on using it solely for the hp and not for chasing/running.
  8. blckdrgn

    blckdrgn Well-Known Member

    Scorched Earth
    Time 8/10/12/14
    Regen 15/20/25/30
    HP 120/200/300/420

    Most of the time when I use soul ring it is when I am chasing with scorched earth so the HP loss is negated.
  9. Shamanics

    Shamanics Banned

    I loled at the bold part. If there is any hero that a retard can have good farm with is lucifer, 25 mins hex should be no problems with this hero.
  10. smashville

    smashville Well-Known Member

    You're still using scorched earth to negate the SR penalty rather than using it to save yourself or finish someone off. Again it's only temporary 150 mana when doom costs more than that, if you get a purge creep that costs 150, I believe war stomp is 100, SE is 75, lvl death is 110 and has a short cd. Your mana pool is too crappy to support all of those moves with just a SR and void stone. Plus if you're getting a void stone you might as well turn it into something useful like linkins or euls.
  11. smashville

    smashville Well-Known Member

    If all you do is farm it's possible or max devour early. But of course there are games where you take some early deaths from ganking and then it takes 25 min or more just to get the mystic staff. Euls is an easy item to farm with a nice disable and an ms bonus that stacks with his other ms bonuses.
  12. blckdrgn

    blckdrgn Well-Known Member

    Well if I was trying to save my self I wouldnt use soul ring and I usually do use soul ring to finish someone off with an extra level death, if necessary you could use scorched earth at the same time to help chase/negate hp loss. Thats why I get it early so that I can spam level deaths on level 5/8/9 heros, no other early game item gives that kind of burst mana. Sure you could say bottle/crow but that relies on runes where soul ring is always consistent and the HP loss can be negated. It's the perfect early game item for luci.

    Watch the replay and you will see I had no mana issues with soul ring alone.
  13. turtle.slayer

    turtle.slayer Well-Known Member

    if u cant rice 6 inventory items with doom.
    then u dont deserve to play dota.
    specially after radi.
    it becomes even more easier!
  14. blckdrgn

    blckdrgn Well-Known Member

    Cmon if you are going to troll at least try to be funny.
  15. smashville

    smashville Well-Known Member

    No point in watching that replay where the guy with the most hero kills was a cm on a team of carries. There's a 1-10 OD who if he was remotely good should be able to dominate with his ult. Because you stomp some bad people doesn't mean SR is the answer to all your mana problems in every game.

    I'm not saying it's a bad item, I just don't think it can solve all of your mana problems since his pool is so small and his spammable spells are fairly expensive. Give me something with mana and a disable or armor or something else attached to it for more money all day every day.

    You can go for whatever you want. It's all personal preference as the items are all fairly balanced. My personal preference is to get a quick euls so I can level death/euls/se/chase level death again. Or I can use the euls to escape if I'm overwhelmed. Though to be fair I'm from the days when euls was core on every hero and it could be turned to guinsoo. I'm sure it's eaten the nerf stick a lot since then, but to me it's still a very key item on any hero with a limited mana pool.
  16. blckdrgn

    blckdrgn Well-Known Member

    If you are against a mana burn team with silencer/am/lion/kotl/na/etc it wont be enough, so as I suggested earlier instead of phase boots you could get arcane boots, or stick it out till you get the mid game items you are referring to. However early game without a soul ring against these types of heros you will be quickly out of mana and focused on farming only where the luci with a soul ring is already kicking people out of the lane / ganking with lvl death spam.

    BTW I dont get soul ring because it owns noobs, I get it because it allows very early lvl death spam, in any level of play.
  17. Shamanics

    Shamanics Banned

    Even at lvl 1 devour is 80 gold per minute if used well, can be way more. That is the mystic staff alone.
  18. wickedswami

    wickedswami Well-Known Member

    If you don't die, that is..
  19. mrwoodenshoes

    mrwoodenshoes Well-Known Member

    If you want good +ms, just eat the +ms neutral creep. (My personal favorite).
  20. GeneralCash

    GeneralCash Well-Known Member

    you need dagger or lothar, otherwise it's pretty viable. nothing new tho, dagon doom has been around forever and caster items in general are often very useful on him because he can get them extremely fast.

    getting hex/orchid/necro3 before the enemy carry has any real items you can use those items to push really hard. with one hero doomed, one hero silenced or hexed and focused and the carry still not being able to pull his own weight, all you need is some heroes with strong early game ultis (rhasta, zeus, bambi, aa, shaker, lich, anything really) to end the game in 30-35 min. on the other hand, trying to outcarry some medusa with radi/vanguard/curiass/treads when she has linken's/manta might be impossible if her support heroes do their job.

    with what i just said in mind and the fact that the new doom doesn't have to instagib targets, he can just chase with scorched earth and kobold aura, getting dagon might be a waste of time. your pub where you solo vs a terribad furion doesn't prove your point that much.

    if you just want to stomp pubs, standard treads -> lothar -> scepter -> curiass is your best bet since your allies might just afk farm instead of helping you push/gank and then you are fucked.

    still, dagger or lothar is a must in any build because
    a) helps land stomps (don't even start about getting the wolf instead of cent because it's retarded to give up a 2 sec aoe stun for a pathetic crit and a lvl 1 command aura).
    b) lets you surprise buttsex people with doom. the main doom target will stand back and wait for you to waste doom or get stunned/focused/killed before coming into range (unless he's a retard).