I'm gonna need a 3000-3500 account

Discussion in 'Dota 2 Matchmaking and Communication' started by Juice, Dec 31, 2013.

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  1. Juice

    Juice Well-Known Member

    Current rating: 5403

    Some interesting Q&A from this thread

    Dropbox link with a bunch of saved replays

    So basically since there's an extraordinary amount of whine about how RMM doesn't gauge your skill correctly and traps you in elo hell and matches you with retards who go 0-500 every game and everything works against you... I've decided to debunk that

    Now I'm sure as hell not going to feed for 150 games and the calibration to put myself into that bracket, so I'm gonna need one of you PD posters to find me an account in 3000-3500 range that already went through the calibration phase. Remove all cosmetics from it and everything if you don't trust me and think I'm doing this to scam you, I won't mind. The important thing is that it's gonna be only me using that account and solo queuing ranked trying to reach my main's rating

    The point of this ''experiment'' is to see how drowned in dunning kruger you all really are. Maybe it really is unfair and I'll get stuck on 4000 and that will show that MM system indeed is broken? Maybe I'll reach my original rating and show that a bunch of you are just whining bads? Either way the dota community profits. Go!


    And we've got a winner boys, a 2900 calibrated account!

    [​IMG] - current rating
    http://dotabuff.com/players/110289963 - dotabuff

    [​IMG] - my main at the moment
    http://dotabuff.com/players/86751819 - and the dotabuff

    The dotabuff profile will stay open on the 2900 account, I might post updates here when I reach certain benchmarks like 3500/4000/4500 etc, but don't expect this to be fast at all. Basically with +25 per game if I set 5000 rating as my goal, it's gonna take over 150 games, on top of it all it's exam season right now. So basically this ''experiment'' might take even 2 months or more, depending on whether valve has the bonus for win streaks or not.

    UPDATE 2 - 3500


    Summary: Going from 2930 to 3506 took 24 games, a 24 win streak (24-0) and that's around 24 x 25 = 600 rating, still there's no streak bonuses whatsoever so I'm 99% sure there aren't gonna be any regardless.

    UPDATE 3 - 4000


    Summary: The road from 3506 to 4017 took 27 games, (24-3, 89% win rate). I'm pretty sure that I didn't have to lose those 3 games either if i went mid or picked more suitable heroes, however I won't complain too much about it. The skill difference between 3500 and 4000 is there, however the games are not that hard yet (except the rare 1v5 ones). I've had countless games with my allies failing every lane extremely badly, however it's still easy to recover from that and feed on enemies more. I can see why people who wouldn't be able to do that think the MM is handicapping them, however if you can't exploit your enemies more than they exploit your allies then you're pretty much where you need to be. From 47% win rate to 54.55%, a solo queuer's dream

    UPDATE 4 - 4500


    Summary: 4017 - 4509 within 29 games (24-5, 83% win rate), some minor upsets but nothing drastical. I'm really starting to dislike this rating range because people are defeatist, egotistical, they think they're very good at the game and try to tutor everybody else (why do they all think they're smarter than the other people at their rating, sigh), they whine and cry from beginning, try to force their item choices and opinions onto others (which are wrong most of the time) and generally are their own worst enemy and the reason they sit there. Games are generally unenjoyable, everybody seems to be fed up with dota here and while people can get annoying at higher ratings I can assure you it's nothing close to this. People who random heroes are generally -1 in the team as they won't repick even something that they can't play (earth spirit from my slark game) and then will just proceed to feed and be useless all game long. People also tend to tunnel vision a lot and die before using their spells or in extremely dumb ways, laning and farming ability slowly starts to get decent, however game sense is still low.

    UPDATE 5 - THE 5K


    Summary: I've had a rough day today and lost some games here and there, still got to 5k relatively quickly. 36 games, 28-8, 78% win. I can't say that people after 4500 are bad. They can lane decently, farm well, I can't pinpoint any huge mistakes yet I'm still winning a lot and being able to get out of control in most games. I guess it's when small things start mattering. I'd say people still have issues with overlapping disables/running around the fight like headless chicken/throwing the lead. Picks matter, people who random are a burden in most games I've played and I can tell how hard the game will be from picks alone. There also seem to be some people playing like complete utter garbage in either team, maybe it's the account selling but when your maiden is level 5 in 16 minutes and autoattacks the creep wave with 2 enemy heroes 400 range from her in daytime... sigh.

    The end point will be around 5.4k, which is the lowest point I've reached on my main account.

    UPDATE 6 - 5400


    Final summary: 22-6, 79% win. This is the lowest rating I've had on my main before I climbed to 6k and that concludes the experiment after something like 3 months. A total of 2500 rating, 122-22 overall score (85% solo queue win rate wow forced 50%!) and moving the account from 47% win to 60% win. 16 out of 22 losses were in 4500-5400 range. Playing from 5000-5400 for me meant meeting the same players that i meet on my main, except i got teamed with 6k players instead of playing against them. The skill difference is noticeable only in 1v1 lanes, otherwise I'd say consistency and decision making are the real deal that separates these players from the leaderboard's top dogs. I hope you people enjoyed following this experiment and learned something from it, the MM system seems to be more precise than what most think and it's proven that it certainly puts people where they belong.

    I've been muted for the past 20 or so games and had only 3 pings to communicate due to not binding chat wheel, however i felt it was enough, it just made games less enjoyable.
    Last edited: Aug 25, 2014
  2. sand-fish

    sand-fish Well-Known Member

    good plan.

    But the problem is, the whiners aren't actually interested in the truth.
  3. xpforever

    xpforever Well-Known Member

    I have a smurf eligible for ranked but I think it's higher than that.

    Although I think that what we need is multiple data points. Don't just see if the account eventually gets to the proper MMR. Play X games on multiple accounts, and see what MMRs they end up. In theory, they should end up all the same, but who knows.
  4. 5chneemensch

    5chneemensch Well-Known Member

    That isn't even elo hell. The elo hell system is more complex than simply end up losing all the time.
  5. NraYZdgeurL

    NraYZdgeurL Well-Known Member

    Wish you good luck with your plan.
    Really want to see how it works out.
  6. otomo

    otomo Well-Known Member

    Good luck, not sure anyone will be giving their account though so you might want to post this plan on other websites.
  7. erik-the-red

    erik-the-red Well-Known Member

    I'd give you one of my smurfs, but none of my smurfs meets the Level 13 requirement, though two of them have > 150 games played. Having said that, if you don't mind grinding a few unranked matches and going through the calibration matches, I'll give you one of them.

    Smurf 1
    Smurf 2

    My main account's solo MMR is ~3200. Both of my smurfs used to be in "high," but then I lost so much MMR in both of them that I'm sure they have to be around the same MMR as my main.
  8. theonly_USA_pro

    theonly_USA_pro Well-Known Member

    If you really want to maximize your point, I suggest playing all your games at late night when the foreigners start coming on and others aren't really around. You can show that communication is not really inherent to winning, either.
  9. juraculation

    juraculation Well-Known Member

    Shouldn't GodlyKha have some smurfs with an adequate amount of games? They won't have gone thru the calibration phase but someone can play those by feeding. Also dunno how willing he would be to lend those.
  10. xpforever

    xpforever Well-Known Member

    You'd have to feed a lot of games to get down from whatever MMR those are at to 3k. 3k is pretty abyssmal.
  11. Spartangold

    Spartangold Well-Known Member

  12. juraculation

    juraculation Well-Known Member

    depends, didnt he experiment with lotsa builds
  13. xpforever

    xpforever Well-Known Member

    And won with them.
  14. SkyforgerXVIII

    SkyforgerXVIII Well-Known Member

    pls give the man an account :cat:

    Can't this be some exception you cherrypicked? This looks pretty bad.
  15. Spartangold

    Spartangold Well-Known Member

    Most games I get are stomps, either me winning or losing. My point is it is significantly tougher to go from 4k to 5k mmr simply because teamplay is much more emphasized as compared to 3k-3.5k when you can simply outplay your opponent.

    All it takes is one person to fail to carry out his role and whole team is pretty much fighting an uphill battle.
  16. apocalypse58

    apocalypse58 Well-Known Member

    I do Actually have 2 accounts 3800 and 5100 and it's weird my smurf got higher rank and i check the difference around 3700-3900. i roughly have a hard time and mostly around 3 out of 10 of my games at least one of my teammate absolutely feed and for worst mid lane. i did manage to make my account reach 4100 and then another losing streak because of gamethrowers going back to 3800 and noticed that always lose mostly at mid night 9PM-2AM(GMT +3). not sure if i'm just unlucky or i'm that bad.
  17. Juice

    Juice Well-Known Member

    This is pretty much what I need, however the calibration matches award tons of rating based on performance and I shouldn't be playing them since I'd probably get over 500 rating from them alone, not to mention grinding 2-3 more levels on those accounts would also raise the MMR significantly. I would need an already calibrated account in that MMR range, only if u had more games on those...

    His smurfs aren't on that low MMR, I'm sure he's' around 5k

    Well this is also good, however I wanted a bit lower MMR to show that if you can climb from 3000, then you can't be stuck at 3500, 4000, 4500 etc either. However if no lower account is available soon I think I'll do it on that one
  18. Trew

    Trew Well-Known Member

    I've got a secondary account on 5300 mmr and I have to literally throw games on purpose to lose. It's that hard, so ye ELO hell is a myth.
  19. erik-the-red

    erik-the-red Well-Known Member

    If you can't get anyone else to give you a smurf in this range, ask me again. I'll give you my 104-105 smurf. I know it's suboptimal for several reasons, two of which we've already mentioned, which mean that currently, I don't know exactly what the MMR is.

    But my main's MMR is ~3200, and I'm very sure that this smurf's MMR is similar. I lost so much MMR that I went from being 100% in "high" for over a month to getting matched with a Pudge who thinks that phase, drums, and armlet in Lifestealer by 20 minutes is bad farm, but who himself could only get arcanes and a hood by 26 minutes.

    If you can get the MMR visible and close to your MMR, I would 100% accept that ~3200 is where I belong.
  20. Kris

    Kris Moderator

    It would only take a few days to make this kind of account doing little but jungling heroes and not joining the game.

    Interested in seeing the results and would be interested to see someone else try to replicate it.
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