6.61 Development

Discussion in 'DotA Chat' started by IceFrog, Jun 15, 2009.

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  1. ~Maktor~

    ~Maktor~ Well-Known Member

    It's so fucking funny that people really think their stupid suggestions will be in 6.61...

    Icefrog will only get 90% of useful information here, and implement just 20% of that useful information...so, about 2% of this topic is useful...

    I laught hard seeing "clinkz" buffs...he is so fucking fine, lol...
     
  2. DirtyEpic

    DirtyEpic Well-Known Member

    -Buff Weaver
    -Nerf new Tauren
    -Buff QoP
    -Ms buff on sniper
    -Also why didn't you added the new Naga's Ulti icon that got so many thumbs ups in D-A? I think that pengui have to go home.

    Thanks for make us participate, You are doing an excelent job froggy.
     
  3. MikeShox

    MikeShox Well-Known Member

    Just the Poor's Man Shield that should be disassembleabe.
    And the melee form of it can be used by ranged Syllabear.
    ^^
     
  4. squ1sh

    squ1sh Member

    See, I mentioned that I hope Ice takes on idea, or get inspiration from one idea to do his own thing. I'm not so arrogant to think that all of a sudden I'm a dev for dota. That's just silly talk. Dunno bout you, but I have fun thinking about how to change and improve games I play since that's what I'm going for in the professional world. More practice and thought I give it, the more I benefit.
    The fact that the developer of a game even talks to the player base tickles my tummy in a way that makes me say "Awwww.... " and kick my legs in joy.
    :rofl:
     
  5. DirtyEpic

    DirtyEpic Well-Known Member

    Well, this guy have a point.
     
  6. Teh_Haaaaat

    Teh_Haaaaat Well-Known Member

    Melee heroes should not be able to compete with Range heroes this well.

    Make tree chopper tree and only able to cut down trees (60sec CD)
     
  7. DirtyEpic

    DirtyEpic Well-Known Member

    Also, i'll add a magina buff. He IS the worst carry in the game.
     
  8. InvisAkaColin

    InvisAkaColin Well-Known Member

    Nerf batrides STR gain plox
     
  9. ~Maktor~

    ~Maktor~ Well-Known Member

    How can you say such a retarded thing? MAGINA IS FUCKING IMBA RIGHT NOW, how can yo usay he is the worst carry!!!!!! He should be N-E-R-F-E-D!!!!!! LOL!!!!

    This is an obvious change, and i guess IceFrog plays DotA with his buddies, and i hope one of his buddies picked up magina, so IceFroggy can see the pain in the ass he is now... lol

    Also, a goooooooooooooood good change would be remove the fucking total useless Poor Man's Shield... it's not totally useless, IT JUST RUINS UR ITEM BUILD IF YOU ARE MAKING WRAITH BANDS AND A VANGUARD AT SAME TIME, AND THE STOUT SHIELD MIXES WITH UR SLIPPERS OF AGILITY, just that.

    just remove it, and will be fine, lol :laser:
    and NERF magina :laser:
     
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2009
  10. squ1sh

    squ1sh Member

    Yeah, I don't understand how slipper of agility mix to make a shield.
     
  11. Pascal3000

    Pascal3000 Well-Known Member

    rofl you play too much pubs. Warlock is one of the top tier heros, rikimaru, trax and nessaj are rarely seen on top level.


    Balance:
    TC:
    -Fix dmg values slightly. Either only heros or lower amounts for both. More along the lines of decay in terms of clash usefullness
    -Slightly reduce efficiency of the aura on armor only for heros. Maybe 50% effectiveness on heros but double the AoE or something along those lines, ONLY for armor imo.
    -Slightly higher delay on the ultimate or something, or just make it 1 second channeling to create the rift and then lower the actual delay

    Razor:
    -Slight tweaking of numbers for a slight nerf

    NA:
    One of the permanent bans on league level needs a slight nerf or rework to not be such a mandatory ban or pick.

    Bane:
    Was already a constant league pick and still got 2 buffs with the patch, needs a slight nerf to make up for it...

    Quelling:
    Possibly rework to make it a little fairer to ranged heros. Some of them really need the support in terms of lasthitting (especially many agi ranges), while others would get terribly overpowered lasthitting skills though (see warlock, even though hes not supposed to farm much)
    Maybe % bonus based on main stat or something


    Metagame: As i already posted in the 6.60 feedback thread, im really worried that metagame / playstyle wise, 6.60 was a step in the wrong direction. You managed to get away from the long drawn out, farm dependant and boring playstyle of older patches which was basically good carries holding a lane for 30 minutes and then clashing with lategame items. 6.59 was one of the most gank dependant and action packed patches in a long time and brought more exiting to watch dota matches.
    Alot of the changes in 6.60 again favor a slower, more farming oriented playstyle and will easily kill the cool 6.59 style of play =(
    To list a few:
    • Syllabear buffed
    • Sven Buffed
    • Troll buffed
    • Terrorblade buffed
    • Magina
    • Mortred Semi-Buffed
    • Juggernaught / Void / NS Semi-Buffed
    • MKB Buffed
    • Radiance Buffed
    • Better jungling / farming capabilities for agility heros with quelling / new stout / poor mans shield
    • Bottle shows rune stored = less suprise ganks

    On the other hand, alot of the more push / teamfight oriented semi-carries that were popular got a strong nerf (bloodstone nerf, dirge, necro, dp, tinker)

    This slower, boring playstyle is not what i want and is not favorable for drawing attention to the competitive scene. Theres been no matches like the recent performances of KS.int, Ravens, MYM/K, Mouz, OS.one, EG, dmz and many of the asian teams which im familiar with, as i dont follow that scene too much :p All of these epic matches were only possible because of the 6.59 playstyle. Dont destroy this...

    EDIT: And finally fix that goddamn -oi coloring bug...
    http://www.playdota.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2130
     
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2009
  12. DisToRK

    DisToRK Member

    Make batrider not this overpowered lol

    ---------- Post added at 10:26 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:26 PM ----------

    batrider .. overpowered.
     
  13. Vector_NET

    Vector_NET Well-Known Member

    QoP's Poison Sting should be remade to aoe one like venos's or something better..
     
  14. Mahlay

    Mahlay Well-Known Member


    So true, make quelling blade only work on neutral creeps or remove it ... its way too game-breaking....
     
  15. ZGiSH

    ZGiSH Well-Known Member

    Buff:
    -Sniper. All of him.
    -Batrider

    Nerf:
    -TC's PASSIVE. Only his passive.
     
  16. Antifate

    Antifate Well-Known Member

    Add like .4 seconds onto the casting time of TC's stun. Reduce his ult damage a bit.

    Weaken Quelling Blade slightly.

    Buff Weaver, WR, Furion, and Ghost Staff.
     
  17. THE-FAT

    THE-FAT Well-Known Member

    Just please don't hit TC with a nerf blast of death. People still don't know how to deal with him and he isn't that bad. I think his aura is a little OP, but other than that I think he is fine.
     
  18. Zakharov

    Zakharov Well-Known Member

    Batrider and Razor: Leave them how they are. Give the community time to accurately determine their power level before buffing/nerfing them.
    Tauren Chieftain: A slight nerf is probably appropriate, but don't go too far. I'm guessing he'll be a lot less powerful in a week when people become better at avoiding Earth Splitters.
    Weaver: He could use either better stats, or more synergistic skills. At the moment, he has a very powerful support skill, a powerful ganker skill, a decent DPS skill, a good tank skill, and not enough stats to support any of those roles.
    Dirge: I don't think the 6.60 nerfs went far enough, although it wouldn't be unreasonable to spend more time finding out before nerfing him further. A powerful Dirge is good for the health of the game, as he's a fun hero who encourages pushing and teamfights, but any hero as powerful as 6.59 Dirge is not healthy.
    Quelling Blade: It's fine how it is. It's nice to have an item that makes it easier for newer players to lane well before spending the 50 hours necessary to master the last-hitting timing minigame.

    To the other posters in this thread: You have to be careful when buffing some heroes. Certainly, Sniper, Pit Lord and Void are very weak this version. Do you really want a version where such heroes are strong? Keeping the power levels of hard carries and turtlers below that of other heroes is one way of preventing the game from degenerating into the kind of farmfests seen in 6.52e. When buffing Sniper-style heroes, you want to turn them from trash heroes into mediocre heroes that are situationally viable. This requires careful, incremental buffs, such as the recent Shrapnel and Refraction buffs.
    EDIT: To clarify a bit, there will always be some heroes which are more powerful than other heroes. It's an unavoidable consequence of having over 90 unique heroes. The game is more fun when the powerful heroes are fun to play, and encourage a style of gameplay which is fun. This is why 6.59d is so much better than 6.52e. In 6.59d, fun heroes like Dirge, PotM, Admiral, Storm, Rhasta, Axe, etc. make up a large part of the top tier of heroes, and those heroes encourage a playstyle based around team fights and pushes, the most fun parts of a DotA game. In 6.52e, the top tier contained more boring heroes, and the playstyle was focused around farming, the most boring aspect of a DotA game.
    The corollary to this is that DotA is also more fun if there's a wide range of viable heroes. It's fun to try unusual strategies and unusual heroes, even if they aren't in the abstract more fun than the top-tier heroes. Of course, this is a balance issue, and balance is notoriously hard to achieve.
    I think the best approach is to leave some fun, powerful heroes at the top. Zeus, NA, Warlock and PotM have remained at the top for years because they deserve that place. They encourage ganking and pushing, and discourage farming. Other heroes can be rotated into and out of the top tier as the versions go by - SA was powerful in 6.57, then got nerfed back. Necrolyte had his time in the sun in 6.59. Tauren Chieftain will probably have his go before being sent to mediocrity. Apart from the top tier, effort should be made to keep almost all other heroes at a similar power level, keeping the more boring heroes towards the lower end of this. This allows almost all heroes to see occasional play, and allows interesting strategic decisions based around medium-tier heroes.
    Some of you are probably asking, why not make all heroes the same power level? You can't. As I said before, there will always be top tier heroes. Trying to prevent this means losing control over which heroes and strategies are powerful - you're as likely to get a farm-centered version as a gank-centered or push-centered version.
     
    Last edited: Jun 16, 2009
  19. MalaKa911

    MalaKa911 Well-Known Member

    Lower enigma's blackhole cooldown on all levels by 10 seconds. <3
    Oh and also, fix sniper. Please.
     
  20. ScepTeR^

    ScepTeR^ Well-Known Member

    please oh please Nerf the batrider's grapple Thingy ... at least make the grappled unit to be able to move/attack/cast spells .
    Thanks for all your hard work .:rambo:
     
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